Chinese stealth fighter flies!

[guranteedseed1]

Quick- name five innovative military creations from either China or the (former) Soviet Union...

(Cue sound of wind blowing).


This thing is likely to be as stealthy as Joan Rivers leading a parade. And frankly, taking a lesson from Russian planes of the last few decades- its a long way between flying a prototype and deploying combat-capable numbers of these things.

Su-35, Su-37, MiG 1-42, Yak-141, Su-47... fabulous, pretty, airshow prototypes. And that's all that exists. (Except for the Yak, which did exceptional in tests, until they lost one of the pair to a crash, then the Soviet Union collapsed and it was never continued).


Maybe we'll send Clint Eastwood in to steal this Chinese plane.

Ak 47?

 

[busaguy79]

Its not Just their Stealth Fighter that i'm worried about, its their new anti ship cruise missles that they say can take out a carrier.

Yeah China is doing a lot of chest thumping right now and you can take it either way, just we can't go into some future conflict, (possibly Taiwan) thinking these are just the backwards Chinese trying to use 30 year old Russian equipment.

It is a real possibility that in about a decade China will have weapons just as advanced as ours!

 

[TheAdmiral]

I saw a BBC article that mentioned this, also that China is possibly working on some kind of carrier-killer missile

 

[Trident1]

It's most likely a flying piece of crap. The Chinese have never made a decent aircraft engine.

 

[busaguy79]

It's most likely a flying piece of crap. The Chinese have never made a decent aircraft engine.

From what I read its new Russian engines that are capable to supercruise, also the Chinese probably have most of the info they need to start making copycat engines of the ones we got!

 

[Trident1]

From what I read its new Russian engines that are capable to supercruise, also the Chinese probably have most of the info they need to start making copycat engines of the ones we got!

I'm not worried one bit. We own the skies through our use of integrated air superiority.
The Chinese have squat. Maybe they can fly that crate around the interior and hope it doesn't fly apart.

The Chinese should stick to building missiles....and buying their aircraft from the Russians.
Building their own "stealth" looks like so much photoshop.

 

[domshooter]

Ak 47?

thats a gun....... not a plane.







:nanner::nanner::nanner:

 

[vodkazvictim]

It's cockpit displays are Ipads... It's not like it's really hard for any nation with a defense budget to come up with one. We've been gallivanting around with the Raptor for so long it's only logical. And it's not really hard technology to duplicate, or steal...

There's nothing good about f22.

Yes. But remember that China is using this as a positioning tool. It's a political move all the way....yet in the background Chinese engineers are working to improve it. The Irbis-E is limited as it targets earlier generation aircraft. And this technology is always changing. This is what Russian engineers do not admit.

How can you be sure it only targets earlier generation aircraft? F117 and f22 both use angular lines and LO materials to achieve stealth, where's the difference? It's not like f22 is flying Plasma stealth. Anyway, the moment Russian engineers come up with a radar that can see thru the latest stealth tech, they'll pop the old Irbis E radar off the SU 27 variant, pop the new one in and put it in the sky :dunno:

Ak 47?

BMP APC, BTR APC, SU25, Super cavitating torpedo, stealth (Pyotr Ufimtsev discovered it, but the VVS decided it provided too much cost for too little benefit to field it).

It's most likely a flying piece of crap. The Chinese have never made a decent aircraft engine.

Yep. And thanks to chinese copying Su27 and not paying, it's unlikely the Russkis will sell the little sods a decent aircraft engine.

From what I read its new Russian engines that are capable to supercruise, also the Chinese probably have most of the info they need to start making copycat engines of the ones we got!

They did do a pentagon internet probe a few years back which managed to "peel off tereabytes off info about raptor". What do you wanna bet the guy in charge of internet security got promoted sideways?

I'm not worried one bit. We own the skies through our use of integrated air superiority.
The Chinese have squat. Maybe they can fly that crate around the interior and hope it doesn't fly apart.

The Chinese should stick to building missiles....and buying their aircraft from the Russians.
Building their own "stealth" looks like so much photoshop.

You own the skies through battle-experienced pilots. The chinese just don't have that - ergo they'll lose.

thats a gun....... not a plane.







:nanner::nanner::nanner:

He said innovations, not planes.

 

[domshooter]

He said innovations, not planes.

ah, touche, so he did. my bad

 

[shimmy2]

No experience means they'll get pwnd.

what he said :ak47:

 

[Bearded_Menace]

From what I read its new Russian engines that are capable to supercruise, also the Chinese probably have most of the info they need to start making copycat engines of the ones we got!

Well, they are good for ripping shit off that"s for damn sure. They are much like Led Zepplin in that respect.:2 cents:

 

[Death-Proof-69]

fuckin F-22 rip-off...bastards!

 

[busaguy79]

Still think the Navy should of took the YF-23 and made it the F-14 replacement instead of the superhornet, be more suited to take on this Chinese stealth fighter if anything is to happen.

 

[zdenka]

Chinese copied from Russia
Russia copies from France
France copies from Germany
Germany copies from America
America copies from.... Zimbabewe

 

[maildude]

.
How can you be sure it only targets earlier generation aircraft? F117 and f22 both use angular lines and LO materials to achieve stealth, where's the difference? It's not like f22 is flying Plasma stealth. Anyway, the moment Russian engineers come up with a radar that can see thru the latest stealth tech, they'll pop the old Irbis E radar off the SU 27 variant, pop the new one in and put it in the sky

It's not that easy. Newer variants of stealth make small changes across wider areas of a plane's structure to offset changes in radar technology...the same way an exterminator changes insecticides to offset an insect's ability to resist. The Chinese are using the earlier form of the Irbis technology, and it's undergone many changes since its inception in 2004. Also, Chinese versions of stealth are in such an early stage, that American research has the opportunity to improve its LFR and bistatic capabilities, and its LPI radar. Plus, Chinese military development relies mostly on imported Russian technology. Propulsion systems aboard most Chinese aircraft still use outdated Russian Su-27 technology. Stealth planes have to think about two things: detection of the aircraft itself, and detection of the systems the aircraft is using onboard. In the latter case, the Chinese have a long way to go. Lasly and most simply, the J-20 is really big. Bigger than any of its Russian or American counterparts. It doesn't matter how advanced your detection systems are, bigger is easier to see, it has to hold more, it has to use more avionic and targeting systems, and it has to use more fuel. These are all considerations that the Chinese military must take into account.

 

[vodkazvictim]

fuckin F-22 rip-off...bastards!

How is it similar to an f22?

Still think the Navy should of took the YF-23 and made it the F-14 replacement instead of the superhornet, be more suited to take on this Chinese stealth fighter if anything is to happen.

There's SOOOO much wrong with the hornet it makes me every time...

Chinese copied from Russia
Russia copies from France
France copies from Germany
Germany copies from America
America copies from.... Zimbabewe

Are you being serious? If so explain.

It's not that easy. Newer variants of stealth make small changes across wider areas of a plane's structure to offset changes in radar technology...the same way an exterminator changes insecticides to offset an insect's ability to resist. The Chinese are using the earlier form of the Irbis technology, and it's undergone many changes since its inception in 2004. Also, Chinese versions of stealth are in such an early stage, that American research has the opportunity to improve its LFR and bistatic capabilities, and its LPI radar. Plus, Chinese military development relies mostly on imported Russian technology. Propulsion systems aboard most Chinese aircraft still use outdated Russian Su-27 technology. Stealth planes have to think about two things: detection of the aircraft itself, and detection of the systems the aircraft is using onboard. In the latter case, the Chinese have a long way to go. Lasly and most simply, the J-20 is really big. Bigger than any of its Russian or American counterparts. It doesn't matter how advanced your detection systems are, bigger is easier to see, it has to hold more, it has to use more avionic and targeting systems, and it has to use more fuel. These are all considerations that the Chinese military must take into account.

To be honest I don't see it, but the science behind stealth was never really that interesting or intelligable to me, so... :dunno:
But lets face it: f22, 20 odd years in the design phase (still many problems) - not gonna be invisible to Irbis E.
F35 years - years in design phase, poorly thought through - not gonna be invisible to Irbis E.
What do you think will evade Irbis E? Skat? Petit Duc? I think Irbis E isn't obsolete... yet.

I agree that the aircraft is too big... A lot of 'em are these days. In the gaps between wars aircraft grow bigger and fatter, then they shrink a lil to usefull size...
But lets be honest; chinese leadership was never really that bright - the sods passed a law against sparrows once. No, I'm not joking, go look it up.

 

[busaguy79]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110112/wl_nm/us_china_stealth

Well China says they are not going to do anything to directly threat the US in the Pacific region.

I just wished our Carriers weren't full of Bugs and Super Bugs, Should have The Tomcat 21 in service!!
Attack Super Tomcat 21 (ASF-14)

If the Tomcat 21 was a relatively low cost structural modification to the F-14D then the Attack Super Tomcat 21 (hereafter referred to as AST-21) was the most advanced derivative Grumman could make, both in terms of aerodynamics and avionics.
As well as the structural changes mentioned above the AST-21 would have thicker outer wing panels, allowing even more fuel to be carried. Larger external fuel tanks would also be developed. Flaps and slats would be further refined, reducing approach speeds by 18mph.
A new version of the F110, the GE F110-GE-129 would power the aircraft, giving the potential for the AST-21 to supercruise (achieve and sustain supersonic flight without need for fuel hungry afterburners) at up to Mach 1.3. Vectoring nozzles were also considered, but felt unnecessary when the design displayed a 77 degree angle of attack without the vectoring nozzles.
To aid servicing and repairs all maintenance controls would be grouped onto a single panel.
In the cockpit each crewmember would receive colour MFD's and helmet mounted displays. A single piece forward canopy would replace the present windscreen, enabling full all round vision for the first time.
Carrying the nav-attack FLIRS of the other variants the AST-21 would replace the AN/APG-71 with an electronically scanned unit, incorporating a host of air-to-air and air-to-ground modes. This would have twice the power of the AN/APG-71 and be among the biggest leaps in capability. Some reports suggest this radar would have been that developed for the A-12. Defensive electronics would also have been upgraded, with the AST-21 carrying 135 packets of chaff/flares in launchers on the LAU-7 missile rails.
At present it is unclear whether the ASF-14 differed in any notable way from the AST-21, but the former was the designation used when the Navy carried out a serious study of the Grumman proposals in 1994. Unfortunately for Grumman the study decided the ASF-14 to be unaffordable. As a result the Navy moved ahead with its present plans to develop the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet variants.

 

[vodkazvictim]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20110112/wl_nm/us_china_stealth

Well China says they are not going to do anything to directly threat the US in the Pacific region.

I just wished our Carriers weren't full of Bugs and Super Bugs, Should have The Tomcat 21 in service!!
Attack Super Tomcat 21 (ASF-14)

If the Tomcat 21 was a relatively low cost structural modification to the F-14D then the Attack Super Tomcat 21 (hereafter referred to as AST-21) was the most advanced derivative Grumman could make, both in terms of aerodynamics and avionics.
As well as the structural changes mentioned above the AST-21 would have thicker outer wing panels, allowing even more fuel to be carried. Larger external fuel tanks would also be developed. Flaps and slats would be further refined, reducing approach speeds by 18mph.
A new version of the F110, the GE F110-GE-129 would power the aircraft, giving the potential for the AST-21 to supercruise (achieve and sustain supersonic flight without need for fuel hungry afterburners) at up to Mach 1.3. Vectoring nozzles were also considered, but felt unnecessary when the design displayed a 77 degree angle of attack without the vectoring nozzles.
To aid servicing and repairs all maintenance controls would be grouped onto a single panel.
In the cockpit each crewmember would receive colour MFD's and helmet mounted displays. A single piece forward canopy would replace the present windscreen, enabling full all round vision for the first time.
Carrying the nav-attack FLIRS of the other variants the AST-21 would replace the AN/APG-71 with an electronically scanned unit, incorporating a host of air-to-air and air-to-ground modes. This would have twice the power of the AN/APG-71 and be among the biggest leaps in capability. Some reports suggest this radar would have been that developed for the A-12. Defensive electronics would also have been upgraded, with the AST-21 carrying 135 packets of chaff/flares in launchers on the LAU-7 missile rails.
At present it is unclear whether the ASF-14 differed in any notable way from the AST-21, but the former was the designation used when the Navy carried out a serious study of the Grumman proposals in 1994. Unfortunately for Grumman the study decided the ASF-14 to be unaffordable. As a result the Navy moved ahead with its present plans to develop the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet variants.

I don't trust a word china says.
I'm vaguely familiar with that F14 variant and if I'm not mistaken current F14Ds can supercruise in clean formation (IE no weapons, no wing tanks).
After all, in clean formation the F16XL and the MiG25 can supercruise.

 

[busaguy79]

I don't trust a word china says.
I'm vaguely familiar with that F14 variant and if I'm not mistaken current F14Ds can supercruise in clean formation (IE no weapons, no wing tanks).
After all, in clean formation the F16XL and the MiG25 can supercruise.

Yes in test flights the F-14D was able to supercruise just unfortunate the F-14D was suppose to come into service just a few years into the Tomcats life. The SuperHornet should of replaced the Hornet, replacing the Tomcat was a step backwards! Thats why The Navy should of took the F-23 or revamped Super Tomcat 21 because a carrier and fleet needs her fleet defender!

 

[funkyman]

USA has secret planes capable of we cannot even imagine. In last few years many people saw those triangle UFOs in US and I'm sure it's US secret aircraft with some amazing capabilities, so this stupid chinese "big F-22" is I think no real threat if real big war started.