France's governing party debates secularism

[Hot Mega]

Funny thing is...in the US conservatives would decry a g'ment which did this as loony liberalism run amuck. Although I'm not sure ....consistent with some of their inconsistency would be them cheering it done against every other religion except their's.

I fear the wrath of Georges any moment now though... :condom: (PS Georges, this was not intended to ghettotizationing up your country by mentioning liberalism in this thread.:o)

PARIS – President Nicolas Sarkozy's governing conservative party held a politically charged conference Tuesday on ways to strengthen secularism in French society, amid worries that it would stigmatize France's millions of Muslims.

The UMP were considering 26 ideas that party officials say are aimed at bringing France's stringent laws decreeing the separation of church from state into step with the times. With Europe's largest Muslim population — estimated at about 5 million — France is much changed from 1905, when the secularism laws were adopted, and they're in urgent need of revamping, the party argues.

The proposals discussed Tuesday include banning the wearing of religious symbols such as Muslim headscarves or prominent Christian crosses by day-care personnel and preventing Muslim mothers from wearing headscarves when accompanying school field trips. It also would prevent parents from taking their children out of mandatory subjects including gym and biology.

The debate could lead to a legislative bill in the National Assembly, where the UMP has a majority.

The round-table comes about a week before a new law banning garments that hide the face takes effect. Under the measure, which takes effect on April 11, women who wear the face-shrouding veils risk a fine, special classes and a police record.

The discussion also comes as Sarkozy's poll numbers continue to slide and as the far-right National Front resurges under its new party leadership. Critics from the opposition Socialist party contend the debate is an electoral ploy aimed at appealing to voters who could be swayed by the National Front.

Continued at link.....

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110405/ap_on_re_eu/eu_france_islam

 

[Red Spyder]

I thought the American government was already secular, just the laws are based on biblical principles.

Good for France anyway. :thumbsup:

 

[BlueBalls]

Sarkozy I believe is, in some polls, currently behind the far right National Front party. This and I'm sure the recent dismissal of multiculturalism (by both him and other European leaders in the wake of rising support for far right parties/groups) seems to be an attempt to try to garner additional support from the far right in order to both help his re-election campaign and stem the tide of political converts in that direction. If it is, Sarkozy and his European peers fail to see the credence he's lending his opposition on the far right in doing so.

 

[CunningStunts]

I thought the American government was already secular, just the laws are based on biblical principles.
:thumbsup:

:dito:

And I'm sure that the religious extremists they are worried about want to kill them has just a tiny bit to do with this re-focusing in France.

And REAL American conservatives (e.g., the Founders) are all for freedom of religion, but also for separation of church and state. :2 cents:

 

[Atar554]

WTG France; no one should be able to walk around in a disguise.

Could you imagine people shopping in stores with ski-masks? Show your damn face or GTFO

 

[DietCrush]

:dito:

And I'm sure that the religious extremists they are worried about want to kill them has just a tiny bit to do with this re-focusing in France.

And REAL American conservatives (e.g., the Founders) are all for freedom of religion, but also for separation of church and state. :2 cents:

true, but an atheist will never be prez of united states. I remember reading a poll that said the people of the us would vote a mnority woman before an atheist. not that anything is wrong with minority woman, just saying.

 

[Will E Worm]

France's governing party debates Secular Humanism.

:hatsoff:

 

[Atar554]

true, but an atheist will never be prez of united states. I remember reading a poll that said the people of the us would vote a mnority woman before an atheist. not that anything is wrong with minority woman, just saying.

Not an "openly" atheist president perhaps.

It'll be a while for that; religion is big business here and its' business is best when belittling the guy that doesn't offer any skycake for being a good soccer mom.

People rather get "high" off the "good news" emotional rhetoric than think seriously about serious issues.

 

[Trident1]

Now watch France's Leftists go after this decision because it might stigmatize muslims. Once again atheists defending Islam.

 

[Atar554]

Now watch France's Leftists go after this decision because it might stigmatize muslims. Once again atheists defending Islam.

Being left doesn't mean you're an atheist though. Just like in America being on the right doesn't mean you're Christian.

 

[prof_porn]

You must either be wholly secular (no religion is allowed, this means no xmas holiday etc) or everyone is allowed. Targeting one group is discrimination and unjust.

I support secularism at the state level whilst believing one is free to practise their faith in the private sphere.

 

[CunningStunts]

You must either be wholly secular (no religion is allowed, this means no xmas holiday etc) or everyone is allowed. Targeting one group is discrimination and unjust.

I support secularism at the state level whilst believing one is free to practise their faith in the private sphere.

What if one religion's holiday is a month long and they can't come to work for the duration? :dunno:

 

[prof_porn]

What if one religion's holiday is a month long and they can't come to work for the duration? :dunno:

Just doesnt happen. Before you say 'Ramadan', I have never seen a Muslim take a month of work for it.

I wager you havent either.

 

[busaguy79]

I just loved organised religion!!

 

[LukeEl]

This is because Liza Harper, Rebecca Lord, and Channone don't do porn anymore.

 

[Trident1]

Being left doesn't mean you're an atheist though. Just like in America being on the right doesn't mean you're Christian.

I'd like to meet a Conservative atheist. Be an interesting mix.


Not all leftists are atheist, but every leftist I know are staunchly atheist( that will change on their deathbed of course).



The French have brass standing up to the muslims in France so I hope the leftists there stand by secularism and don't give in like dhimmis. I won't hold my breath as most leftists are too weak kneed to stand up to Islamists.

 

[Atar554]

I'd like to meet a Conservative atheist. Be an interesting mix.


Not all leftists are atheist, but every leftist I know are staunchly atheist( that will change on their deathbed of course).



The French have brass standing up to the muslims in France so I hope the leftists there stand by secularism and don't give in like dhimmis. I won't hold my breath as most leftists are too weak kneed to stand up to Islamists.

There are conservative atheists but more likely to be moderates though.

I wouldn't assume an atheist would change on their deathbed.

I'm glad the French are standing up to them or trying to. However It's easy to rail against a group of people and everything they do and be a hard ass. It's hard though to be of the political mindset that people should be free to speak their mind and organize etcetc....unless you're of a particular group.

You get to the point where people are abusing the freedom and you have to change your paradigm across the board just for them. Unless you want to have laws that say specifically "Muslims cannot gather in mass" or "Muslims cannot disrupt traffic with organizations or protests or worship" etc...

Don't get me wrong I think they've worn out their welcome in many ways. However I don't want my freedoms limited because they decided they can't function normally.

 

[Trident1]

I wouldn't assume an atheist would change on their deathbed.

Trust me. They would, and will.

 

[ace.venturer]

I'd like to meet a Conservative atheist. Be an interesting mix.


Not all leftists are atheist, but every leftist I know are staunchly atheist( that will change on their deathbed of course).



The French have brass standing up to the muslims in France so I hope the leftists there stand by secularism and don't give in like dhimmis. I won't hold my breath as most leftists are too weak kneed to stand up to Islamists.

:1orglaugh

The centrist has spoken.