Killed by US gunships

[Red Spyder]

well maybe you shouldn't be running around a warzone while carrying things that from a distance could be perceived as weapons. when you hear an apache in the distance you dont walk around and try to find people to film you get the fuck inside and hope they don't fuck your shit up

Somehow I am very convinced that's exactly what the terrorists do. They hear it coming and run and hide. It'd be nice if they didn't. Innocent people for the most part do not run and hide unless there's actually shooting going on. As we see in the video, putting myself in their position, why would I have to hide if I got nothing to do with stuff going around? Of course got to have some common sense about making sure that those soldiers don't see me as a threat (that's what I do when I go to Mexico) but still these soldiers should have been more alert to what they were shooting at. They got good scopes. Of course, I'm pretty sure those helicopter guys now are probably carrying those deaths in their conscience.

 

[domshooter]

Somehow I am very convinced that's exactly what the terrorists do. They hear it coming and run and hide. It'd be nice if they didn't. Innocent people for the most part do not run and hide unless there's actually shooting going on. As we see in the video, putting myself in their position, why would I have to hide if I got nothing to do with stuff going around? Of course got to have some common sense about making sure that those soldiers don't see me as a threat (that's what I do when I go to Mexico) but still these soldiers should have been more alert to what they were shooting at. They got good scopes. Of course, I'm pretty sure those helicopter guys now are probably carrying those deaths in their conscience.

they were alert to what they were seeing. they looked at the guys, with their camera on the Apache, and they saw what seemed to be AK's and an RPG. in what sounded like a combat zone, since it took ground forces 8 mins to get there (if thats accurate from what i saw in the longer video). they asked for permission to engage the "hostiles" because thats their duty, in protecting their ground patrols.

 

[316sherm]

Most of them came from Egypt and Saudi Arabia, but 100% of them were muslims, and 100% of them were doing it because they were attempting to become martyrs in what they perceived to be a "holy" jihad.

You can try to blur the issue, but it's very obvious why they did what they did. They wanted to attack the "unholy infidel, the great satan known as America".

I don't care what country they came from. They were ALL a bunch of extremist muslim pieces of garbage. In my opinion, anyone who doesn't think they care about religion, is very naive.

:glugglug:

 

[maildude]

This is a helluva way to plan an exit strategy.:dunno:

 

[Trident1]

Friendly fire no conspiracy. It was a tragic error.

 

[Kingfisher]

I have absolutely ZERO problem with this. In case some of you have forgotten, this is a war zone, and the pilots were engaging a group of people carrying AK-47's. They were doing their job.

The reporters who got caught in the crossfire should have known better than to hang around a group like that when there are gunships hovering in the area. What did they think was going to happen?

Yeah, you're mistaken. There were people standing around, yes. But there was no weapons out. They were non-combatants. Call sign, Sidewinder... the Apache even called out that RPG's were being fired while they still orbited over the target and took no evasion. Then firing on the van picking up wounded is uncalled for. There's also reports that the same Apache fired on another group of men standing around nearby, but they scattered.

It may be a conflict, there are hostiles in the area, but this was a group just standing there. That wasn't suppressing enemy forces, that was just slaughtering them. If they had fired, then light up up. But this was not the case.

 

[Ulysses31]

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/04/05/iraq.photographers.killed/index.html

Watch the full video if you think the pilots were totally professional. At the end they seem to be pleased they'd hit children as well. As for the men that were carrying guns, like Americans the Iraqis have the right to bear arms, they are in the middle of a civil war (sunni vs shia etc). And why they are in a civil war is because the coalition took out the one crazy tyrant (Saddam) that was running the country and keeping all the crazy b*sta*ds from killing one another through his brutal dictatorship. They had no long term plan as to what to do once he was eliminated, leaving a huge power vacuum in which all these extremist groups rushed in to try and fill. There is no hope for this country now and it's poor people, best the coalition just leaves and cuts their losses before they commit more war crimes and turn more ordinary muslims into extremists who want revenge on America. Bin Laden doesn't even need to produce any more propaganda videos to rally up support, videos like this will do the job. I pity the USA in a way, it should be the most righteous and noble nation on the planet that the whole world looks up to for inspiration, but sadly that will never be.

 

[domshooter]

http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/meast/04/05/iraq.photographers.killed/index.html

Watch the full video if you think the pilots were totally professional. At the end they seem to be pleased they'd hit children as well. As for the men that were carrying guns, like Americans the Iraqis have the right to bear arms, they are in the middle of a civil war (sunni vs shia etc). And why they are in a civil war is because the coalition took out the one crazy tyrant (Saddam) that was running the country and keeping all the crazy b*sta*ds from killing one another through his brutal dictatorship. They had no long term plan as to what to do once he was eliminated, leaving a huge power vacuum in which all these extremist groups rushed in to try and fill. There is no hope for this country now and it's poor people, best the coalition just leaves and cuts their losses before they commit more war crimes and turn more ordinary muslims into extremists who want revenge on America. Bin Laden doesn't even need to produce any more propaganda videos to rally up support, videos like this will do the job. I pity the USA in a way, it should be the most righteous and noble nation on the planet that the whole world looks up to for inspiration, but sadly that will never be.

dude, are you daft? i watched the entire 17 minute video. and they made a specific comment "they should know better that to bring kids into a battle". yea, they may have sounded like they were pleased with what they did, but i highly doubt they actually were. they found out about the kids, AFTER the fact. all that bullshit that whoever made that video did "so and so's body", the arrows pointing to kids etc, yea thats fucking great after they wasted the fuckin van, but its a goddamn war zone. in the moment, you cant see two barely visible heads in the shadow of a car window. the comment they made about kids being in battle, to me, felt like it CAME FROM a remorseful place, even though it may not have SOUNDED like it.

there are fucked up guys in every military on this planet, always have and always will be. but come on everyone, way to make blanket statements. they were doing their job, and dont have a video editing room on board a goddamn AH-64 Apache Gunship!


and this statement:

"I pity the USA in a way, it should be the most righteous and noble nation on the planet that the whole world looks up to for inspiration, but sadly that will never be"

is fucking BULLSHIT. we've dropped from grace in recnt times, but for a very long fuckin time the USA was (and still is in some ways) the greatest country this planet has ever known. everyone wanted, and still wants, to come HERE. everyone asks US for help. say what you will, but in that statement your wrong my freeones friend.

and your from the UK yea? well, first off, your one of our greatest allies, and i am sincerely grateful for that, without you who knows what would be different, am i right? BUT, if im not mistaken, the Empires colonialism in Africa, the Middle East and Asia are one of the main causes that they're all so fucked up (adding of course the French, Spanish, etc etc).

so, im done. flame on now, i suppose

 

[Ulysses31]

dude, are you daft? i watched the entire 17 minute video. and they made a specific comment "they should know better that to bring kids into a battle". yea, they may have sounded like they were pleased with what they did, but i highly doubt they actually were. they found out about the kids, AFTER the fact. all that bullshit that whoever made that video did "so and so's body", the arrows pointing to kids etc, yea thats fucking great after they wasted the fuckin van, but its a goddamn war zone. in the moment, you cant see two barely visible heads in the shadow of a car window. the comment they made about kids being in battle, to me, felt like it CAME FROM a remorseful place, even though it may not have SOUNDED like it.

there are fucked up guys in every military on this planet, always have and always will be. but come on everyone, way to make blanket statements. they were doing their job, and dont have a video editing room on board a goddamn AH-64 Apache Gunship!

The scene became a warzone only after the Apache fired on them, otherwise it was a residential street where you often get civilans believe it or not. Unless you're implying that the whole of Iraq is a constant warzone so the military has the right to kill any civilian(s) in the country and dehumanize the events by using the phrase collateral damage. There are also other comments urging the wounded to pick up 'guns' (even the camera will do) so they can shoot them again and laughter as the humvees ran over a body. Bear in mind this is the most technologically advanced army in the world with thorough training and preparation, not a couple of kids playing Call Of Duty. ps It's the most difficult article to find on most of the news websites, almost as if they are ashamed to even report it.

 

[domshooter]

The scene became a warzone only after the Apache fired on them, otherwise it was a residential street where you often get civilans believe it or not. Unless you're implying that the whole of Iraq is a constant warzone so the military has the right to kill any civilian(s) in the country and dehumanize the events by using the phrase collateral damage. There are also other comments urging the wounded to pick up 'guns' (even the camera will do) so they can shoot them again and laughter as the humvees ran over a body. Bear in mind this is the most technologically advanced army in the world with thorough training and preparation, not a couple of kids playing Call Of Duty. ps It's the most difficult article to find on most of the news websites, almost as if they are ashamed to even report it.

uh, i dont think so. did you see that detachment that had to get to the site of the incident? 2 hummers, a bradley, duece and a half, and what looked like one of the damaged vehical transports, which i would assume is for the civilian van. a simple air to ground attack doesnt normally warrant that kind of response, then again, im not an expert.

from the video, it said that it took 8 minutes or so for said detachment to get to the scene, which is quite some time which either means that they either came from a base/forward regrouping area, or they had a hell of a time getting there. now, since the info is thin at best, i suppose we'll not be finding out anytime soon. but still, im going to go out on a limb and say that the area wasnt exactly the average "safe" neighborhood for Baghdad.

so they wanted the people they precieved to be enemy combatants to pick up thier arms so they could be completely taken out of the picture. so what? how many other videos just like this have we seen come out of both war zones with military personel saying nearly the same thing? when you go to war, you want to kill your enemy. period. get over it

and the "laughing at the dead body thing", again i say so what? i personally have seen a few incidents in real life where people were hit by cars and rammed into a wall, or crushed under something heavy, and what was the first thing that came to mind after "ooooooo god damn!"? a chuckle. its because anyone born in the last 25 or so years has slowly become desensitized to death, horror and blood. for whatever reason, its happening, especially here in the US.

~fin

 

[Ulysses31]

its because anyone born in the last 25 or so years has slowly become desensitized to death, horror and blood. for whatever reason, its happening, especially here in the US.

~fin[/QUOTE]

Thankyou, an answer that makes sense. A perfect explanation as to how US troops can kill so readily and easily without any feeling of remorse/guilt/accountability etc.

 

[Wizard Sleeves]

Thankyou, an answer that makes sense. A perfect explanation as to how US troops can kill so readily and easily without any feeling of remorse/guilt/accountability etc.

That's a part of war. Do you think they had any fuckin' remorse in WWI, or even the civil war? Fuck no, they were killing other people because they had an objective that they were trying to accomplish. You don't think civilian casualties are a part of every war, not just wars from 25 years from the past to now? I'm sure there were British who killed Americans (soldiers and civilians) in the Revolutionary war without any remorse or regret.

 

[domshooter]

its because anyone born in the last 25 or so years has slowly become desensitized to death, horror and blood. for whatever reason, its happening, especially here in the US.

~fin

Thankyou, an answer that makes sense. A perfect explanation as to how US troops can kill so readily and easily without any feeling of remorse/guilt/accountability etc.[/QUOTE]

ok, you just completely fucked with what i meant by that statement. i meant that were becoming desensitized to the AFTER EFFECT! it will never be easy to take a human life, for ANYONE, unless you go through extensive training, and even then, they can get fucked over in the head for the long run. and on TOP of that, most of our personel who actually go in country have done multiple tours. both in the air, or on the ground. theyve seen shit that you or i cant possibly imagine. and im sure they all know multiple people have been kill, or disabled mentally and/or physically. we've had more casualties than any other country combined. so gee, i think maybe our guys and gals will take death a little better.

its not just the US, i think itd be safe to say that the UK, france, italy, canada, japan, china are all having this process thrown at them because of video games, movie, music, tv pretty much anything.

do you have a problem with the USA or something? cause you seem to think that every one of our foot soldiers are cold blooded, dont give a shit murdering people.

 

[ajitpd]

That's what happens when you hire strret thugs of gangsta and video game generation as soldiers.

 

[domshooter]

That's what happens when you hire strret thugs of gangsta and video game generation as soldiers.

where in the hell do you live? i know more than 30 servicemen and none of em are "street thugs".

i swear, am i the only one who thinks like i do, who understands what the fuck is going on?

 

[Mayhem]

where in the hell do you live? i know more than 30 servicemen and none of em are "street thugs".

i swear, am i the only one who thinks like i do, who understands what the fuck is going on?

Nope, you're not the only one. I find it discouraging (although it's hardly anything new) that people look at one video and become instant experts at war. There are many elements of the view that I have that I don't like, especially where they light up the van that was picking up the wounded. But a war zone is a highly confused place.

I will say this. After Desert Storm, I have a very poor opinion of helicopter gunships or, at least, the people who crew them. My tank battalion lost 4 tanks to Hellfire missles fired from our own supporting gunships, including a Company Commanders tank. All our tanks (hell, all our vehicles, period) were properly marked, all were facing in the proper direction, and an M-1 tank has its own silhouette. But the flyboys just lit them up anyway. Thankfully, no one was killed but, there were injuries (says a lot about the M-1).

Sooooo, I'm not a fan of the chopper crowd. I was hoping that their trigger-happy ways would be dampened down by now, but I'm not sure it has.

 

[iammaic]

It's something when the US makes a "mistake" people go crazy about it. A few years ago russia invades a country and intentionally kills civilians. The country of Georgia. and the intenational community looks the other way.

Some people sit here and say ohhh oh my god that's wrong. I disagree, These pilots did not just fly in there and start shooting. They got permission, after what they believe to be weapons. Maybe they should have flown down there and landed and check them? Making an apache helicopter a target? Is that what some of you want? would that be better?

funny some police officers even though near a criminal cannot tell if the gun is real or not, do they wait to see? No. even robbing a store with a plastic gun is a crime.

Then the moment in the video when they bring kids in a van to get the wounded out? WTF? who brings kids to a combat zone? the man in the striped shirt had a weapon. for security? who knows. My question is this, Did these people have clearence to walk around a combat zone? Also what if terrorists attacked them and we were watching that video, Are they bad for attacking civilians? which they have been doing for thousand's of years.

I am not surprised this happend. Accidents happen to our own soldiers. But I don't put the blame on the pilots only. Are these good reporters?? or are they going out to dig up dirt on the US military. who knows? the whole thing looks fishy to me.

another thing, they are not walking around disneyworld, and they know the risks. they are walking around a combat zone. maybe they could take a little time and put flak vests on with press on them? even if they did that, how do the pilots know they are or are not. I don't only blame the pilots.

 

[iammaic]

where in the hell do you live? i know more than 30 servicemen and none of em are "street thugs".

i swear, am i the only one who thinks like i do, who understands what the fuck is going on?

"street thugs" I wonder do street thugs have diploma's which is a requirement to join the military and also if the person has a criminal record he can forget about being in the military, even if he somehow does get in. He is leaving. and not coming back.

most have college degrees, and that includes people serving in the infantry.

I wonder how much schooling does a suicide bomber need that joins al-queda

 

[Legzman]

My god! That was a very entertaining video?

 

[Supafly]

Iammaic,


get your facts right, if you want to criticize people with different opinions.

The South-Ossetian War was started by thse country of Georgia, as a thorough report by the European Union found out:

http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/0,1518,630543,00.html

You work very well around the fact that the sodliers in the gunship were not really matter-of-factly reacting to a situation like well-trained professionals, do, but, as you might remember, where cheering and begging to have a killing spree. And ultimatley, they showed how cold-blooded murderers they are, as there came that car and the bodies were tried to be taken away. WHERE WAS THE THREAT???

That was plain murder, even if we give them the benefit of the doubt they might be so stupid as to mistake a camera or two for guns.